|
It is currently Mon May 21, 2012 4:23 am
|
View unanswered posts | View active topics
| Welcome |
|
Welcome to outlanderbookclub
You are currently viewing our boards as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content, and access many other special features. In addition, registered members also see less advertisements. Registration is fast, simple, and absolutely free, so please, join our community today!
|
|
Page 1 of 1
|
[ 10 posts ] |
|
| Author |
Message |
|
sassenach
|
Post subject: VOYAGER: Chapter 37: What's in a Name Posted: Tue Oct 04, 2011 5:41 am |
|
 |
| Clan Fraser |
 |
Joined: Thu Dec 10, 2009 11:58 am Posts: 4139 Location: England
|
 Voyager: Part Seven Home Again Chapter 37: What’s in a Name © Diana Gabaldon 1994  Please discuss Outlander, Dragonfly in Amber and Voyager ONLY in this thread. Thanks! The SPOILER Thread can be found hereKeeping watch over Jamie, Claire realises that the injections of penicillin are successful in treating his fever, and that 18th century germs are no match for 20th century antibiotics, and yet, whilst her presence in the house is tolerated, she is still cause for suspicion, and curiosity. When Claire realises that Jamie is beginning to wake up, her first words to him are, “Don’t stall”, I said crisply “Open your eyes, and tell me about Laoghaire”With narrowed eyes, Jamie views the threat of the hypodermic needles, and starts his explanation: Following his release from the English Lake District, and with his years of exile behind him, Jamie makes his way back to his beloved Scotland and to an uncertain future at Lallybroch. Time had changed the family, and Jamie felt increasingly uncomfortable amongst people who to a large extent didn’t really know him. He was lost and lonely. Jenny as ever watchful of her brother’s needs, encouraged him to remarry, but he found none of the local ladies attractive or desirable enough – until the night Jenny invited Laoghaire to the Hogmanay party at Lallybroch..... The house bright with candles, decorated with holly and ivy, and alive with sound of pipe and fiddle, provided the romantic impetus that Jamie needed, and when approached by Laoghaire- he agreed to dance with her.......and between the laughter and the dancing, the deal was set... Knowing that Laoghaire was a widow with two young daughters, Jamie made the decision to marry her quietly at Laoghaire’s home at Balriggan, and settled his belongings there, but from the beginning the marriage was uncomfortable “ God, I never knew what to do for her, or what to say !” Laoghaire was volatile and unpredictable, and their shared intimacy was uncomfortable, and despite Jamie best efforts, Laoghaire continued to resist his lovemaking. Jamie made the decision to leave “ I couldna’ bear it anymore “Despite her resolve not to touch Jamie beyond the boundaries of careful medicine, Claire finds herself increasingly drawn to him, and in the safety of night, the two of them in quiet gentleness bare their souls.. “For so many years”, he said “for so long, I have been so many things, so many different men” -__ “I was uncle to Jenny’s children, and ‘brother’ to her and Ian, ‘Milord’ to Fergus, and ‘Sir’ to my tenants. ‘Mac Dubh’ to the men of Ardsmuir, and ‘Mackenzie’ to the other servants at Helwater. ’Malcolm the Printer’ then, and ‘Jamie Roy’ at the docks” __”But here” he said so softly I could barely hear him, “here in the dark, with you......I have no name”
“I love you” I said, and did not need to tell him how I meant it.
• How do you view Jenny’s meddling in Jamie’s life – was she right to push Jamie and Laoghaire together in this way • Why do you think Jamie and Laoghaire’s marriage failed – was Jamie partly to blame? Share your thoughts.
_________________ "It has always been forever, for me, Sassenach"
 
“Sassenach." He had called me that from the first; the Gaelic word for outlander, a stranger. An Englishman. First in jest, then in affection.”
My Book Blog
|
|
| Top |
|
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
 |
|
Lisa SF
|
Post subject: Re: VOYAGER: Chapter 37 : What's in a Name Posted: Tue Oct 04, 2011 5:46 pm |
|
 |
| sapphire member |
 |
Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2011 7:43 pm Posts: 839 Location: San Francisco, CA
|
|
Given the facts at her disposal at the time, I don't think Jenny was wrong to encourage Jamie to remarry. It's indisputable how much Jenny loves Jamie, and I think she was trying to find him a new purpose to his life, something to anchor him to the here and now and hopefully bring a little joy back into his life. Of course, WE all know that Laoghaire wasn't a great choice, but I believe that Jenny was trying her best to take care of her brother.
Based on what we know up to now in the series, it's hard to find fault with Jamie for the failure of the marriage. It sounds like he really tried his best, and tried to provide for Laoghaire and her children. Haunted as he was by the memories of his love with Claire, it's not hard to imagine that Jamie would have held back in some way, emotionally, from Laoghaire, which would only have added to their difficulties. Still, although we (and Jamie) don't know the specifics, something happened to scar Laoghaire. After knowing such openness and passion in his marriage with Claire, being with a woman who constantly shrank from him must have been excruciating for Jamie.
I love that Claire is so firm in her decision to stay. She's really back! Now it's just a question of how she and Jamie will sort things out, but they're clearly back together.
|
|
| Top |
|
 |
|
Pauline
|
Post subject: Re: VOYAGER: Chapter 37 : What's in a Name Posted: Tue Oct 04, 2011 8:36 pm |
|
 |
| Clan Fraser |
 |
Joined: Thu Oct 01, 2009 7:19 pm Posts: 1612 Location: Rhode Island
|
|
It's not surprising with his "rescue me" complex, that Jamie would settle on Loaghaire to marry and expect to consummate this marriage and live together in harmony. What he forgot was how immature Loaghaire is and he's forgotten the long held theory that "Hell hath no fury like a scorned woman". Jenny's matchmaking never bothered me here. This was a good match for the time and once Claire could sit and listen to Jamie, and Jamie could be honest, she would forgive him anything. Claire has never been one to hold a grudge which is one of the main characteristics that I always loved about her character. She's impulsive and jumps to conclusions, but in the end, she's always forgiving.
There is no blame in a failed marriage like J & L. They just didn't belong to one another.
|
|
| Top |
|
 |
|
audiobooklover
|
Post subject: Re: VOYAGER: Chapter 37 : What's in a Name Posted: Tue Oct 04, 2011 10:01 pm |
|
 |
| Clan Fraser |
Joined: Mon Jul 19, 2010 6:09 pm Posts: 2683
|
I thought Jenny' matchmaking made a lot of sense in this case, so I don't fault her for that. And, I think some of the biggest problems between Jamie and Laoghaire were related to past experiences (largely for Laoghaire - whatever happened to her, but also Jamie's expectations of a marriage based on his time with Claire). A couple of other random observations: - Claire mentions that her penicillin could even cure syphilis in no time. That seemed like foreshadowing of treatment for possible syphilis that will come later in the book. - When Jamie described the Hogmanay gathering and the women turning around and walking out the door with closed eyes and then opening them to see what they see first, it reminded me of Claire doing the same thing on Roger's suggestion before she left the 20th century. And, Ned Gowan is still alive!  I do like that man, despite him being a lawyer. 
|
|
| Top |
|
 |
|
KellyH
|
Post subject: Re: VOYAGER: Chapter 37 : What's in a Name Posted: Wed Feb 08, 2012 1:18 pm |
|
 |
| topaz member |
 |
Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2012 5:06 pm Posts: 77 Location: Elkins, WV
|
I agree with everyone here...I think Jenny was just trying to help Jamie heal in one of the only ways she knew how. She (meaning Jenny) has never left Lallybroch - she admits that it's all that she knows of life, which also means that she only knows the happiness / contentment that her own marriage and bairns have given her. I think she wanted the same thing for Jamie and since she truly didn't understand the situation (meaning she just thought Claire dead), she thought it was a simple matter of finding another woman to comfort him. The only section here that I think is a mistake is on page 459 - when he talks about the fiddles and the urge to join in the dancing. I find THIS odd because we are told over and over again (in DiA, Voyager and even DoA) how Jamie is tone deaf. I know he danced well in France too (in DiA), so maybe I just don't understand what tone deaf means though 
_________________ "I mean to make ye call me 'master', Sassenach." His soft voice was a threat of revenge for the agonies of the last minutes. "I mean to make you mine."
|
|
| Top |
|
 |
|
repoman
|
Post subject: Re: VOYAGER: Chapter 37 : What's in a Name Posted: Wed Feb 08, 2012 2:50 pm |
|
 |
| Clan Fraser |
Joined: Wed Feb 16, 2011 5:47 am Posts: 1506 Location: Kalamazoo, Michigan
|
|
Kelly, I kind of have the opposite problem from Jamie. So, I feel qualified to explain. Jamie can dance (and I can't) because he recognized the beat in the music (when to take a step). But, he cannot hear the pitch of the notes. So, he "canna carry a tune" - he would sing off key.
|
|
| Top |
|
 |
|
kerry j
|
Post subject: Re: VOYAGER: Chapter 37 : What's in a Name Posted: Wed Feb 08, 2012 3:31 pm |
|
 |
| emerald member |
Joined: Sun Jan 29, 2012 10:57 pm Posts: 298
|
|
You don't even have to be able to hear to dance well....all you have to be able to do is feel the beat. I remember well the wedding reception for a cousin of mine who was born deaf....a number of the guests were of course friends from school who were also deaf...and some of the best dancers I have EVER seen!
|
|
| Top |
|
 |
|
Raelin
|
Post subject: Re: VOYAGER: Chapter 37 : What's in a Name Posted: Wed Feb 08, 2012 5:26 pm |
|
 |
| topaz member |
Joined: Tue Oct 25, 2011 6:46 pm Posts: 61
|
|
I agree with others that Jenny's desire for Jamie to wed was out of her love for him and her wanting him happy. Their relationship has always seemed pretty special--she must have been more aware than others of how deep his despair was. As to who is at fault in the failed marriage? Knowing Jamie's sense of honor, and his belief about an oath, I think he would have given all he had to make the marriage work. That being said, all he had was probably only a portion--that's all that was left him without his Claire. However, it seems to me Laoghaire didn't even want as much as a portion?? Maybe only a very tiny bit of him that served her own broken needs. That could not have made even a passable marriage! I felt so sad for Jamie--all he had gone through, and then to be denied the comfort that could have been shared. Raelin
|
|
| Top |
|
 |
|
KellyH
|
Post subject: Re: VOYAGER: Chapter 37 : What's in a Name Posted: Wed Feb 08, 2012 7:49 pm |
|
 |
| topaz member |
 |
Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2012 5:06 pm Posts: 77 Location: Elkins, WV
|
repoman wrote: Kelly, I kind of have the opposite problem from Jamie. So, I feel qualified to explain. Jamie can dance (and I can't) because he recognized the beat in the music (when to take a step). But, he cannot hear the pitch of the notes. So, he "canna carry a tune" - he would sing off key. kerry j wrote: You don't even have to be able to hear to dance well....all you have to be able to do is feel the beat. I remember well the wedding reception for a cousin of mine who was born deaf....a number of the guests were of course friends from school who were also deaf...and some of the best dancers I have EVER seen! Thank you both - I don't know why I thought it meant he couldn't hear the music...I need to pay better attention to what is actually being written/said rather than my feelings about it KellyH
_________________ "I mean to make ye call me 'master', Sassenach." His soft voice was a threat of revenge for the agonies of the last minutes. "I mean to make you mine."
|
|
| Top |
|
 |
|
Janet23
|
Post subject: Re: VOYAGER: Chapter 37 : What's in a Name Posted: Wed Feb 08, 2012 8:21 pm |
|
 |
| emerald member |
 |
Joined: Wed Nov 02, 2011 8:41 pm Posts: 476 Location: Atlanta, Georgia
|
|
I think Jenny really thought that marriage was the best thing for Jamie. He could settle down and have a family. Jenny has a very closed world. She under estimated the hold that Claire had on Jamie. In her world people lost their spouses often and then remarried. She also under estimated or did not know that state of mine of Laoghaire. Marriage ment that Jamie would stay with the family.
|
|
| Top |
|
 |
|
Page 1 of 1
|
[ 10 posts ] |
|
Who is online |
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests |
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum
|
|