BOOKS: BDB: #10 - Lover Unleashed - Payne/Manuel

Chickie · **Joined:** Mon Aug 02, 2010 7:34 pm **Posts:** 298

Maybe before JRW gets into the nitty gritty of Tohr's book, perhaps someone needs to get her a GPS ~ so she can find her way back to the heart of the BDB series.

TwilightTINK · **Posted:** Sun Jun 12, 2011 12:28 am

chickie, why don't we draw her a map!

TwilightTINK · **Posted:** Thu Jul 07, 2011 9:41 pm

I am reading this book right now - about 75% through it. So far, the only problem I have is that there are way too many story lines going on.

TwilightTINK · **Posted:** Sun Jul 10, 2011 2:01 pm

Okay, so I literally just finished this book in the last 15 minutes. I really liked it. There was maybe too much going on with Xcor and the lessors and the murderer on the loose but I loved Payne and Manny's story.

As for Butch and V, I don't get the uproar! They time together in the apartment was not a sexual act. It was strictly therapy - stripping away the anger, the guilt, the suppressed memories of the torture done. It was bringing V to the core of what happened, accepting it and moving on. I don't see any betrayal here to either Jayne or Marissa as there was nothing sexual about it at all. Neither even approached it from a sexual point of view. Neither got a sexual release from it. In fact, they both suffered horribly because of it. I thought it was actually one of the most loving scenes between 2 non-mated characters as Butch gave V what he needed to heal and release hundreds of years of suppressed emotion. Did I miss something here??? Did we read the same book???

aquagirl · **Posted:** Sun Jul 10, 2011 7:23 pm

with Tink. I don't see this as a sexual infidelity issue. Butch and Vishous had an instant male bonding from the moment they met, when he was still just a "human cop" intruding on the BDB's private world. I think that they needed each other to work through some of the deeper traumas, beyond what their shellans could provide. I am glad they are there for each other.

Chickie · **Joined:** Mon Aug 02, 2010 7:34 pm **Posts:** 298

TwilightTINK wrote:

As for Butch and V, I don't get the uproar! They time together in the apartment was not a sexual act. It was strictly therapy - stripping away the anger, the guilt, the suppressed memories of the torture done. It was bringing V to the core of what happened, accepting it and moving on. I don't see any betrayal here to either Jayne or Marissa as there was nothing sexual about it at all. Neither even approached it from a sexual point of view. Neither got a sexual release from it. In fact, they both suffered horribly because of it. I thought it was actually one of the most loving scenes between 2 non-mated characters as Butch gave V what he needed to heal and release hundreds of years of suppressed emotion. Did I miss something here??? Did we read the same book???

I can respect you opinion here Tink, I really can. Even though in reality they've been friends are relatively short time, I do think that V & Butch are extremely close. In fact, they are the equivilant to the mating of best friends. However, I don't think the scene in the V's Commodore Condo was something the two of them needed to experience. I believe it was something that Jane could have done for V. As I read it, it is disrespectful towards the mates place in both V & Butch's lives, (more Jane than Marissa). IMHO, JRW crossed a toe over the line in this scene.

Just an aside, the 'official' BDB site is still down; wonder what's going on?

aquagirl · **Posted:** Mon Jul 11, 2011 11:36 pm

Chickie wrote:

Maybe before JRW gets into the nitty gritty of Tohr's book, perhaps someone needs to get her a GPS ~ so she can find her way back to the heart of the BDB series.

I discovered today that Tohr's book will be called Lover Reborn and is expected to be published in March 2012. The cover is causing some controversy on some BDB sites as the male depicted does not fit some people's visual of what Tohr looks like in their heads. As long as the book sticks to the :<3:

of the BDB series I will be estatic.

Joanne Maria · **Joined:** Fri Jul 30, 2010 6:32 am **Posts:** 123

Chickie wrote:

TwilightTINK wrote:

As for Butch and V, I don't get the uproar! They time together in the apartment was not a sexual act. It was strictly therapy - stripping away the anger, the guilt, the suppressed memories of the torture done. It was bringing V to the core of what happened, accepting it and moving on. I don't see any betrayal here to either Jayne or Marissa as there was nothing sexual about it at all. Neither even approached it from a sexual point of view. Neither got a sexual release from it. In fact, they both suffered horribly because of it. I thought it was actually one of the most loving scenes between 2 non-mated characters as Butch gave V what he needed to heal and release hundreds of years of suppressed emotion. Did I miss something here??? Did we read the same book???

I can respect you opinion here Tink, I really can. Even though in reality they've been friends are relatively short time, I do think that V & Butch are extremely close. In fact, they are the equivilant to the mating of best friends. However, I don't think the scene in the V's Commodore Condo was something the two of them needed to experience. I believe it was something that Jane could have done for V. As I read it, it is disrespectful towards the mates place in both V & Butch's lives, (more Jane than Marissa). IMHO, JRW crossed a toe over the line in this scene.

Just an aside, the 'official' BDB site is still down; wonder what's going on?

I have to agree with both of you. This was a very powerful scene. There is a connection between V and Butch that is difficult to understand.

JRW did step a bit over the line, but I think that was her intention.

TwilightTINK · **Posted:** Tue Jul 12, 2011 1:15 pm

Chickie wrote:

TwilightTINK wrote:

As for Butch and V, I don't get the uproar! They time together in the apartment was not a sexual act. It was strictly therapy - stripping away the anger, the guilt, the suppressed memories of the torture done. It was bringing V to the core of what happened, accepting it and moving on. I don't see any betrayal here to either Jayne or Marissa as there was nothing sexual about it at all. Neither even approached it from a sexual point of view. Neither got a sexual release from it. In fact, they both suffered horribly because of it. I thought it was actually one of the most loving scenes between 2 non-mated characters as Butch gave V what he needed to heal and release hundreds of years of suppressed emotion. Did I miss something here??? Did we read the same book???

I can respect you opinion here Tink, I really can. Even though in reality they've been friends are relatively short time, I do think that V & Butch are extremely close. In fact, they are the equivilant to the mating of best friends. However, I don't think the scene in the V's Commodore Condo was something the two of them needed to experience. I believe it was something that Jane could have done for V. As I read it, it is disrespectful towards the mates place in both V & Butch's lives, (more Jane than Marissa). IMHO, JRW crossed a toe over the line in this scene.

Just an aside, the 'official' BDB site is still down; wonder what's going on?

Chickie, you know I love you :<3:

. I am curious what you thought was disrespectful towards the mates here.

As I said, I didn't see it as a sexual thing at all but a breaking down of one's defenses. I just don't think could have done it, she could not have put V through the memories of what the Bloodletter had done and that was what V needed to begin to heal. I don't think Jane could have been so cruel, even if it was necessary.

Chickie · **Joined:** Mon Aug 02, 2010 7:34 pm **Posts:** 298

aquagirl wrote:

I discovered today that Tohr's book will be called Lover Reborn and is expected to be published in March 2012. The cover is causing some controversy on some BDB sites as the male depicted does not fit some people's visual of what Tohr looks like in their heads. As long as the book sticks to the :<3:

of the BDB series I will be estatic.

I was going to mention the same thing Aquagirl. Where can you see the cover? On JRW's Facebook page?

TwilightTINK wrote:

Chickie, you know I love you :<3:

. I am curious what you thought was disrespectful towards the mates here.

:<3:

you right back TwilightTINK!

As I said, I didn't see it as a sexual thing at all but a breaking down of one's defenses. I just don't think could have done it, she could not have put V through the memories of what the Bloodletter had done and that was what V needed to begin to heal. I don't think Jane could have been so cruel, even if it was necessary.

I believe that having Butch 'be there' for V is all in good, but I believe what happened in the condo was something very intimate ~ something a Shellan should do for her Male; not a BFF. Although JRW injected her humor later "I think we're dating now!", I belive JRW wrote the condo scene as V & Butch's sexual moment. Something some of JRW's fans were clamoring for; in other words, I believe JRW bent to the will of some of her fans ~ not listening to the voices of her characters. I do disagree about Jane; JRW has written this character as a strong and intelligent female; one who w/out a doubt would do anythng for her guy. IMHO, V's healing began in Lover Unbound by Jane. I think she has it in her to have continued V's therapy.

aquagirl · **Posted:** Tue Jul 12, 2011 10:23 pm

Chickie, you can see the cover for Lover Reborn on the goodreads.com page. I don't see anything about it on the J.R. Ward official site or FB page. I found out about it on the BDB yahoo group. People are also fussing on the yahoo group about Tohr's story coming before one about Quinn and Blay (referred to as "Quay"). I don't have a problem with Tohr's HEA coming first--he's suffered too much, too long.

TwilightTINK · **Posted:** Wed Jul 13, 2011 1:43 pm

Chickie wrote:

aquagirl wrote:

I discovered today that Tohr's book will be called Lover Reborn and is expected to be published in March 2012. The cover is causing some controversy on some BDB sites as the male depicted does not fit some people's visual of what Tohr looks like in their heads. As long as the book sticks to the :<3:

of the BDB series I will be estatic.

I was going to mention the same thing Aquagirl. Where can you see the cover? On JRW's Facebook page?

TwilightTINK wrote:

Chickie, you know I love you :<3:

. I am curious what you thought was disrespectful towards the mates here.

:<3:

you right back TwilightTINK!

As I said, I didn't see it as a sexual thing at all but a breaking down of one's defenses. I just don't think could have done it, she could not have put V through the memories of what the Bloodletter had done and that was what V needed to begin to heal. I don't think Jane could have been so cruel, even if it was necessary.

I believe that having Butch 'be there' for V is all in good, but I believe what happened in the condo was something very intimate ~ something a Shellan should do for her Male; not a BFF. Although JRW injected her humor later "I think we're dating now!", I belive JRW wrote the condo scene as V & Butch's sexual moment. Something some of JRW's fans were clamoring for; in other words, I believe JRW bent to the will of some of her fans ~ not listening to the voices of her characters. I do disagree about Jane; JRW has written this character as a strong and intelligent female; one who w/out a doubt would do anythng for her guy. IMHO, V's healing began in Lover Unbound by Jane. I think she has it in her to have continued V's therapy.

But do you think V could have responded as he did if he knew is shellan was the one at the helm? First, he knows she wouldn't hurt him, second, I am not sure he would be able to be so vulnerable (come on, he cried like a baby) with Jane. He is the strong male after all. I am just not sure he could have gone to that level of bearing his soul because of his concern with being the strong male for her. jmo. Maybe we agree to disagree on this one point because we love each other too much to do anything else. :hug:

aquagirl wrote:

Chickie, you can see the cover for Lover Reborn on the goodreads.com page. I don't see anything about it on the J.R. Ward official site or FB page. I found out about it on the BDB yahoo group. People are also fussing on the yahoo group about Tohr's story coming before one about Quinn and Blay (referred to as "Quay"). I don't have a problem with Tohr's HEA coming first--he's suffered too much, too long.

Oh how he has suffered!!! :agree:

BOOKS: BDB: #10 - Lover Unleashed - Payne/Manuel

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